lord of the flies.
i sat in church a few weeks back.
it was a really archetectually asthetic structure, with wood beams, sterling silver, and large windows. honestly it felt more like a loft than a church. i wanted to live in it, not practice my faith there.
as the service went on i noticed something so very peculiar. basically everyone that went to church there looked like they were from silver lake, california or williamsburg, nyc... basically 'hipsters'. not that i have anything against that at all, but upon further observation i saw that there was not one old person in the building, then i realized that there was not even one older person there, then i realized that there was not one person over 40 years old!
in the book 'lord of the flies' a group of boys get stranded on an island and end up having to fend for themselves, before long one by one a group of the boys began to kill the other. it is a fascinating read, and short, and is one of my favorite books because it shows the shear barbaric state we digress to when not held accountable.
in this country, because this is not a global phenominon, we value youth or the apperance of such. i am not sure why or how we 'digressed' to this state but i feel we are doing ourselves and our communities a disservice by alienating those who have more wisdom, knowledge, and years to share.
have we so segregated ourselves from those who have time on their side, thus limiting our knowledge of things to come? in essence, if there is 'nothing new under the sun', then aren't people older than us basically time travelers, how much can we learn from those who can see into our future?
we may all go through different experiences, travel to different locations, have different friends; but in this life there are much more that we share in common with our fellow man than we have different. in the same way i feel that our grandparents, people we may work with that are older, our elders, etc. may have an insight into our lives that the people closest to us our age may not have.
what happen to the word 'mentor'? i feel that it is a lost art and life left to the past. i admit that besides my father i do not have one, its not that i am not open to it, i just feel that this current culture does not extend its hand to such. my challenge is to somehow come up with ideas on how to incorporate people 20 years older than you, or more, into your life.
now i digress... are we not slowly creating an island of age in our little world? are we not simply the shipwrecked boys on an island slowly eliminating each other due to our lack of wisdom, knowledge, foresight, and accountablility?
to progress we must incorporate all to learn,
we must learn so that one day we might teach,
-stephen
it was a really archetectually asthetic structure, with wood beams, sterling silver, and large windows. honestly it felt more like a loft than a church. i wanted to live in it, not practice my faith there.
as the service went on i noticed something so very peculiar. basically everyone that went to church there looked like they were from silver lake, california or williamsburg, nyc... basically 'hipsters'. not that i have anything against that at all, but upon further observation i saw that there was not one old person in the building, then i realized that there was not even one older person there, then i realized that there was not one person over 40 years old!
in the book 'lord of the flies' a group of boys get stranded on an island and end up having to fend for themselves, before long one by one a group of the boys began to kill the other. it is a fascinating read, and short, and is one of my favorite books because it shows the shear barbaric state we digress to when not held accountable.
in this country, because this is not a global phenominon, we value youth or the apperance of such. i am not sure why or how we 'digressed' to this state but i feel we are doing ourselves and our communities a disservice by alienating those who have more wisdom, knowledge, and years to share.
have we so segregated ourselves from those who have time on their side, thus limiting our knowledge of things to come? in essence, if there is 'nothing new under the sun', then aren't people older than us basically time travelers, how much can we learn from those who can see into our future?
we may all go through different experiences, travel to different locations, have different friends; but in this life there are much more that we share in common with our fellow man than we have different. in the same way i feel that our grandparents, people we may work with that are older, our elders, etc. may have an insight into our lives that the people closest to us our age may not have.
what happen to the word 'mentor'? i feel that it is a lost art and life left to the past. i admit that besides my father i do not have one, its not that i am not open to it, i just feel that this current culture does not extend its hand to such. my challenge is to somehow come up with ideas on how to incorporate people 20 years older than you, or more, into your life.
now i digress... are we not slowly creating an island of age in our little world? are we not simply the shipwrecked boys on an island slowly eliminating each other due to our lack of wisdom, knowledge, foresight, and accountablility?
to progress we must incorporate all to learn,
we must learn so that one day we might teach,
-stephen
Comments
People would rather destroy themselves over time than witness and realize their own fear even once.
Stephen if you are looking for ideas, you have to read Gary Collins Ph.D blog, he is one of the pioneers in christian psycology and counseling; and my mentor's mentor hehe enjoy
Please feel free not to watch it if you don't want too, I don't want to preach or anything...I just thought it could offer some insight...
(personally I'm interested in listening to the teachings from any faith that offers something neat to learn. Learning is always good because in the end you are in charge of what you believe)
http://broadcast.lds.org/genconf/2009/04/20/GC_2009_04_206_BallardMR___eng_.wmv
Peace
I was homeschooled as a child, and as a result I interacted with many different age ranges, from my younger siblings to my parent's older friends. One of the reasons why my parents chose homeschooling was because of the destructive ingrowth that comes from intensive age segregation. I appreciate people older than me, and younger than me.
Another issue with this is the phenomenon known as the "youth group". The church I attended as a kid eventually did away with the youth group and encouraged the young people to interact with those older than they. There is so much to learn from people older than we are, and there is so much we can give to those who are younger.
And yes, I could probably go on all day about this, but I shall spare you.
okay! i will shut up now haha
When you walk in, he greets you from behind he counter -- even if he's helping other people, because he wants you to feel welcome. Once you get around to checking out (it took me awhile the first time I went in because there was so much to explore) he asks you where you're from, why you're in Providence, and how you are. It's nice because he's a genuine guy and actually wants to know, not just make conversation.
I can't really explain our conversations that we had very well because a lot of it was connection, but Jagdish will take the time to have a conversation with you if it's not really busy. We once had a conversation that lasted a better part of an hour. I learned a lot about him, his life in India, how he studied in Canada, and how he came to Providence. He is/was an avid picture taker but doesn't have all his rolls of film developed.
I also spoke to him about things that had troubled me at the time because my friend and I weren't talking for the past few weeks but speaking through what we had gone through for the past few years. It really helped because speaking with him helped me make the decision to go talk to her right after I got back. Now my friend and I are closer because of the mentoring Jagdish did.
Stephen, when you're in that area and you have the time I recommend stopping by. I learned a ton from him.
Thanks for posting (& reading),
Sarah Hewett
Exscuse my typos.
-Sarah Hewett
I believe that this devalue and disrespect for elders is due to their exclusion in this tech savy world as well as the largely individualistic society of America. Individuals do whatever they can to achieve the highest they can with little regard and recognition for others and everyone has the notion that he/she knows best and people forget to learn from others.
As an individual I believe that we as people can learn from every individual we come in contact with. I learn from the preschools that I teach and my grandmothers alike. We have to learn to appreciate the diverse world we are presented with and take advantage of the vast experiences of the people around us.
Which is why I loooove my church.
It is composed of all different ages, we also have a mentoring program which I have happily been a part of for two years! Not only have I gotten the chance to have a mentor, I am a mentor.
The more and more we leave the internet and technology out of the picture, the more actual face to face relationships we are able to have.
i completely agree with this post. interesting that you bring it up in the context of the church. i was born, raised and continue to attend the church my dad's family has attended since 1964. the median age in the congregation right now is probably about 60. there are probably half (or more) retired people there, and i love it--there is an insane amount of life experience i can just soak in from them. i have also worked in politics since i was 9 years old... and the amount of knowledge i have been able to learn from the political "veterans" i couldn't even put a price on. thank you again for the post--and for all your post. i can't wait for the next one.
--sarah
My mom moved in with us when my parents divorced and I must say that it has enriched our home. I'm not saying that there has not been some moments, but when I hear my daughter refer to her grandma as "her friend"...well I wish that I had taken the time (when I had more time!) when I was younger to listen to her and respect her wisdom and years!
i love you and all your very inspirational and moving blogs though.
keep them coming!
And yeah, I wish we had more "mentors," but it's getting harder and harder to trust people these days.
i guess one of the reasons why people (sad to say, myself included) don't value the older generation for their "wisdom, knowledge, and years to share" is because the current state of the society has taught its inhabitants to fast-forward their lives and only grasp hold of the crux of every single detail. we simply do not have time to slow down, listen and absorb.
i love that book as well i read it this year in school
it has so many meanings
Sums it up for me.
I am not sure of the source of the following quote, "Youth is wasted on the young." As insulting as it may seem on the surface it is clearly a cynics point of view.
What younger people may not realize about older people is how many of them view their own youth. It feels like it was just yesterday, graduating from High School, college parties, Graduation, first "real jobs" making your way in the world.
Just because we are old does not make those experiences less palpable and real. I hear older people remark, "if I only knew then what I know now..." How different I would do things!
Older people are like living instruction books all around you in your life. Most likely not wanting to push their agendas and style on others but more than willing and even honored to be of some help to the young people around them.
I like what Gina brought up about the "face to face socialization". In a sermon series I’m listening to by NYC pastor Dr. Tim Keller, he mentions experiencing someone face to face. You get the essence of the other person and experience the person unlike any other way.
Well, I want you to know I gain great insight and perspective from the young people in my life including many commenting here on Stephen's blog.
Thanks,
I don't mean to say that parents are bad these days exactly, by the way one brings up a child is quite different now. Much of what a person becomes is shaped by what they learned in their formative years.
More notably, a few friends & I keep in touch with our high school religion teacher, who is in his late 40s or early 50s - I don't know for sure - and was a big inspiration & influence on us. For me personally, he continues to be, & I do look at him as a kind of mentor.
I like spending time with people older than me & speaking with them. We never stop learning about people & the world, & they have a lot to teach.
So history repeats again. I now have had thirty candles on my cake: it comes as a surprise to me. I don't feel irrelevant or out of it at all. I DO get dismissed as not knowing about life by the teens in my group, UNTIL they hit the wall. Funny how flying too close to the sun and crashing brings things into perspective. I only wish some of these kids would just observe and learn the lessons without having to make the mistakes themselves. You don't have to taste EVERYTHING life has to offer..some of it is poison. Listen carefully!
Seek mentors your whole life I still DO... I also seek to be a mentor constantly.
Each generation should have it's hand in the one above and the one below it! That way we are all bring each other forward!
LOVE IT!
Book of Job chapter 8 vs
8 "Ask the former generations
and find out what their fathers learned,
9 for we were born only yesterday and know nothing,
and our days on earth are but a shadow.
10 Will they not instruct you and tell you?
Will they not bring forth words from their understanding?
I just read this and have recently been thinking so much on this very same topic! Practically begging for wise insight from true mentors in my life. Not just anyone, but those who would truly sharpen me and also those who "get" my personality, giftings, and ways that I need to be challenged, comforted, and sharpened. I want to warn against listening to anyone just because you need advice. But listen, learn, assimilate, and adjust as necessary. Then apply.
Learn from the former generations. Learn from history. History often repeats itself. Such is the nature of human life. Especially on relationships and love. The human heart and nature has faced the same struggles over time if only in different ways.
Proverbs 4:7
Wisdom is supreme; therefore get wisdom.
Though it cost all you have, get understanding.
very interesting...
One warning though: Wisdom and age aren't inseparable. Not everyone who has lived a long life has learned from it. Discretion is always a necessity.
to progress we must incorporate all to learn,
we must learn so that one day we might teach,
{Quoted for Truth}
20/30-something run churches are gaining popularity in our culture.
churches that are neither led by, nor contain older people. and no children.
we seem content to lead succesful single lives, where there may be community, but there is little family.
what a selfish and lonely state of existence.
I agree that the older generation has so much to offer that is often set aside. I reckon that they should make it compulsory for students to get an older mentor at some point during their high school years. My mentor is a lovely lady... she's so wise and fun and it's great to have someone to talk to about anything. So many young people feel stranded and lost and alone.. perhaps this is because they're isolated from the older generation and their experiences? Society is saying we're too cool for them.
As for church - we have a youth service and a morning service, but the only difference is the type of music. We have nearly as many older folk come to the youth service as young people. I love it :)
I can't make much of a judgment on the context of the church, however, not being a church-goer myself (I'm agnostic, actually, which some people may find more than a little ironic here). If I were more in touch with others of my age, I might see more of what you have pointed out. But as a person, I have always connected much easier with people much older than me, and only have a few people I actually enjoy speaking to who are my age.
Mentors, however, are important, but more than having one person to rely on in that position I think it's more important to speak to a range of people. Different beliefs can only enhance your knowledge and experiences, even if those beliefs are not your own - you won't be 'corrupted' by another viewpoint, since you can learn from it and instead strengthen your own views.
And 'Lord of the Flies' disturbs me. I won't deny that there is brilliance and more than a little truth in the tale, but at the same time what ends up being practised on the island goes against everything I have ever believed in. I can't comprehend people wanting to do such things, so I really couldn't enjoy it - it makes me cold to the core. I uphold my morals rigorously.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gP1-tGQzO_0
He's now resigned, thank God!!
Society has a stigma for how you should not only act, but think at different ages. At 22 years old it is ok to do ____ but at year 27 it is frowned upon. I think the society's expectations have had an absorbing effect on all people in our culture; people take this cultural expectation and make it their own governing agent absentmindedly.
STAND UP! Don't look at your age as a hindrance, but as a platform to educate younger people as well as connect with older ones (tell self). Use the knowledge you have to help others, yet be more than willing to accept gems from other people, young and old, alike (talking to myself again).
Stephen,
I don't know how well this post relates with yours and others, but I felt it present in my mind to articulate and share with the audience. God bless.
Our elders can give us guidance, but their views can sometimes be flawed because they're unwilling to change. If you want to be around a mixed bag of ages, try a different church, there is value in older generations opinions.
I'm not sure why you feel people aren't willing to stretch their hands to mentoring. It's a defeatist view, and you're stereotyping.
"Are we not slowly creating an island of age in our little world? are we not simply the shipwrecked boys on an island slowly eliminating each other due to our lack of wisdom, knowledge, foresight, and accountability?" <--that was a little dramatic.
"To progress we must incorporate all to learn,
we must learn so that one day we might teach" Our country and most (if not all) aspects of everyday life are run by people 20+ years older than us. How are they Incorporated?
Funny you mention this, because I have been wanting a mentor. I have been thirsty for that wisdom. Maybe I'm strange, but I love learning. Not just in an academic sence, but about life in general. It's hard when you aren't close to your parents, because usually that would be any 18-year-old's mentor. I try, but we just don't know how to communicate. I doubt you will read this because this isn't your most recent entry, but I just wanted to say I appreciate this post. I felt like a dependent baby, but maybe it is okay to feel like this.
-Kaila
I work with youth on a native american reservation. Youth that need mentoring badly. Many of these young people have not met their fathers, some say if they had the chance, they wouldn't want to meet him either.
I have been mentoring 3 boys over the past 3 years. One has now gone off to college, and the other two are getting ready to graduate. These are pretty big accomplishments where they come from. I feel that these accomplishments would not have been possible if it weren't for mentorship. The family structure here is often self destructive, but I aim to change that.
Have you read Donald Millers new book? A million miles in a thousand years?
Please read it, he speaks much about mentoring. Donald also started The Mentoring Project. A great organization that I think you could help get involved in.
http://www.thementoringproject.org/
Respectfully
-jacob
The effect of survival and dominance is greatly portrayed in the society we live in everyday. The strong over the weak. The dominant over the submissive. The powerful over the powerless.
I love "Lord of the Flies". I can't imagine what would happen if I was one of the kids who were stranded